Een korte verhal...

[mor]

Hallo allemaal,
forgive me if I introduce this exercise (which I hope is in the right place) in English but I want to be sure to make myself clear.

In order to practice the language I wrote this very short story, I tried to use the past tense although I still don't know how to use it, but from a narrating standpoint it was necessary. Since I used the same approach for all the occurrences, they might be all wrong or maybe all (kind of) correct. Trial and error right?
Moreover I have used a few expressions that are most likely out of my league, and I had to lookup several words and verbs in the vocabulary and I'm pretty sure most of them are not as appropriate as I hope.

In order for those amongst you who will undertake the task of reviewing my essay to better understand what I have been trying to write, I have divided the story into sentences followed by an as literary as possible English version, set in Italic and in a slightly lighter color.

I hope I forgot nothing, so sit back, relax and enjoy: Pieter en de vraag.

Kleine Pieter beklom op de boom om wat appels te nemen maar wanneer hij was op de tak, een slimme eekhoorn kwam uit en zegde aan hem: denk jij dat de appels van dit boom zijn de beantwoorden voor je vragen?
Little Pieter climbed on the tree to get some apples but when he was on the branch, a smart squirrel came out and said to him: do you think that the apples from this tree are the answer to your questions?

Kleine Pieter aanstaarde de eekhoorn en keek om zich heen, dan, alles de appels begon praten, eerste die verder van hem en dan die van dichtbij, maar ze allemaal praatten en niemand konden begrijpen.
Little Pieter gazed at the squirrel and looked around, then, all the apples started to talk, first those farther from him and then those closer, but they all talked together and nobody could understand.

Zo Pieter zegde: alstublieft meneer Eekhoorn, ik wil gaan, ik weet niet wat zegt u, ik wil terug thuis gaan.
So Pieter said: please Mr. Squirrel, I want to go, I don't know what you are saying, I want to go back home.

De eekhoorn liep naar Pieter en weer zegde: denk jij dat de appels zijn de beantwoorden?
The squirrel stepped towards Pieter and said again: do you think that the apples are the answer?

Dan Pieter begon huilen en de appels alles aan hem lachten maar de eekhoorn onmiddellijk zweeg hun en weer zegde:
Then Pieter started to cry and all the apples laughed at him but the squirrel immediately shut them up and again said:

Pieter, denk jij dat de appels van dit boom zijn de beantwoorden voor je vragen? Zo Pieter antwoordde: ... maar, maar, ik heb geen vragen te vraag, meneer Eekhoorn, ik begrijp niet wat u wilt zeggen!
Pieter, do you think that the apples from this tree are the answer to your questions? So Pieter replied: ... but, but, I have no questions to ask, Mr. Squirrel, I don't understand what you want to say!

Dan, onverwacht, een luid herrie kwam van de basis van de boom.
Then, all of a sudden, a loud noise came from the base of the tree.

Wat was dat, zegden de appels? De eekhoorn in plaats daarvan stond bij en weer ondervraagde aan Pieter: de vragen Pieter, je vragen, de vragen je altijd vraagt, zijn deze vragen in de appels van dit boom?
What was that, said the apples? The squirrel instead stayed still and again inquired Pieter: the questions Pieter, your questions, the questions you always ask, are these questions in the apples from this tree?

De herrie was luider en alles de appels voor hun lot vreesden maar de eekhoorn was categorisch en keek aan Pieter wie wist niet wat te zeggen.
The noise was louder and all the apples feared for their destiny but the squirrel was resolute and looked at Pieter who didn't know what to say.

De luide herrie werd luider en luider, dan stopte.
The noise became louder and louder, then stopped.

Langzaam de boom brokkelde op de grond en alles de appels overal rolden; ook Pieter en de eekhoorn vielen.
Slowly the tree crumbled on the ground and all the apples rolled everywhere; also Pieter and the squirrel fell.

De appels jammerden in pijn, Pieter keek aan de termieten dat knabbelden de boom en de eekhoorn weer zegde: PIETER! DENK JIJ DAT DE APPELS VAN DAT BOOM ZIJN DE BEANTWOORDEN VOOR JE VRAGEN? DE VRAGEN PIETER, JE VRAGEN, DE VRAGEN, DE VRAGEN...
The apples wailed in pain, Pieter looked at the termites that nibbled the tree en the squirrel again said: PIETER! DO YOU THINK THAT THE APPLES FROM THE TREE ARE THE ANSWER TO YOUR QUESTIONS? THE QUESTIONS PIETER, YOUR QUESTIONS, DE QUESTIONS...


... maar terwijl de eekhoorn zegde zo, twee verplegeren kwamen en bonden de eekhoorn in een dwangbuis en dan sleepten hem naar een psychiatrische inrichting.
... but while the squirrel said so, two nurses (male nurses right?, I hope I wrote it right) came and strapped the squirrel in a straitjacket and then dragged him to a mental institute.

Pieter dan verzamelde wat appels van de grond en terug thuis ging.
Pieter then gathered some apples from the ground and went back home.

Fin

[Joke]

Hoi mor,
Ik heb nu geen tijd om je hele verhaal na te kijken, maar ik zal de eerste zin verbeteren. Misschien kun je dan zelf al een paar dingen verbeteren in je eigen tekst?
I don't have time now to correct your whole story, but I will correct the first sentence. Maybe you can then already correct a few things in your own text?

Topic titel: Een kort verhaal

Kleine Pieter beklom op in de boom om wat appels te nemen plukken maar wanneer toen hij was op de tak zat, kwam een slimme eekhoorn kwam uit tevoorschijn en zei tegen hem: denk jij dat de appels van deze boom zijn de beantwoorden voor op je vragen zijn?
Little Pieter climbed on the tree to get some apples but when he was on the branch, a smart squirrel came out and said to him: do you think that the apples from this tree are the answer to your questions?

Zeggen has an irregular past tense, but a regular participle:
zeggen - zei/zeiden - gezegd

to answer = antwoorden op or beantwoorden
He answered my question = Hij antwoordde op mijn vraag. / Hij beantwoordde mijn vraag.
the answer = het antwoord (plural: de antwoorden)

de boom --> deze boom (near) --> die boom (far)
het huis --> dit huis (near) --> dat huis (far)

In a main clause, the verb always takes the second place in a sentence.
In subclauses, for example after toen or dat, all verbs go to the end of the sentence.
Hij zat op de tak.
Toen hij op de tak zat...

De appels van deze boom zijn de antwoorden op je vragen.
Denk je dat de appels van deze boom de antwoorden op je vragen zijn.

[Bert]

Denk je dat de appels van deze boom de antwoorden op je vragen zijn?

[mor]

Thank you guys, and Joke don't worry, I certainly never expected that you or anybody else rushed into my exercise. Besides, I can be absent for days at times so, really, don't rush.

As for the first corrections, I'll be working on them, even if after a first glance I got so pissed off at myself for I should have known better.
I hate it when I do that, when I get too confident and just write down as the flow goes.

Just on thing though:
een kort verhaal vs een korte verhaal (the single "a" what a typo, I swear!)

Being "kort" the adjective referred to "verhaal" shouldn't it get the "e"?
Or maybe the rule stands but "kort" is an exception?

I mean, if it was "a yellow story" or "a good story", it would be "een gele verhaal" or "een goede verhaal" right?

Thanks for your help so far and have a nice weekend!

Ciao

[Joke]

Just on thing though:
een kort verhaal vs een korte verhaal (the single "a" what a typo, I swear!)

Being "kort" the adjective referred to "verhaal" shouldn't it get the "e"?
Or maybe the rule stands but "kort" is an exception?

I mean, if it was "a yellow story" or "a good story", it would be "een gele verhaal" or "een goede verhaal" right?

With het-words (like het verhaal) it matters whether you use een or het before the noun:
het verhaal is kort
het korte verhaal
but: een kort verhaal

Kort is not an exception. We'd also say een geel verhaal (if this made sense...) and een goed verhaal, but het gele verhaal and het goede verhaal.

With de-words, you don't have this problem, because the adjective always gets an e:
de boom is groot
de grote boom
een grote boom

[Bert]

Kleine Pieter aanstaarde de eekhoorn aan en keek om zich heen. Toen begonnen alles de appels te praten, eerst (de appels) die verder van hem hingen en toen die van dichtbij. Ze praatten allemaal, maar niemand konden hen begrijpen.
Little Pieter gazed at the squirrel and looked around, then, all the apples started to talk, first those farther from him and then those closer, but they all talked together and nobody could understand.

Dus Pieter zei: alstublieft, meneer Eekhoorn, ik wil weggaan. Ik begrijp niet wat u zegt u, ik wil naar huis.
So Pieter said: please Mr. Squirrel, I want to go, I don't know what you are saying, I want to go back home.

[Bert]

De eekhoorn liep naar Pieter toe en weer vroeg hem weer: 'Denk jij dat de appels zijn het beantwoorden zijn?'
The squirrel stepped towards Pieter and said again: do you think that the apples are the answer?

Dan Pieter begon daarna te huilen en de appels alles aan hem lachten allemaal om hem, maar de eekhoorn bracht onmiddellijk zweeg hen onmiddellijk te zwijgen en weer vroeg hem weer:
Then Pieter started to cry and all the apples laughed at him but the squirrel immediately shut them up and again said:

'Pieter, denk jij dat de appels van deze boom zijn het beantwoorden voor je vragen zijn?' Zo Pieter antwoordde: '... maar, maar ik heb geen vragen te stellen, meneer Eekhoorn, ik begrijp niet wat u wilt zeggen!'
Pieter, do you think that the apples from this tree are the answer to your questions? So Pieter replied: ... but, but, I have no questions to ask, Mr. Squirrel, I don't understand what you want to say!

[Joke]

Sorry, I totally forgot to check the rest of you story. But here it is.

Most of Berts changes were correct, just two more corrections:

De eekhoorn liep naar Pieter toe en weer vroeg hem: 'Denk jij dat de appels het antwoord zijn?'
The squirrel stepped towards Pieter and said again: do you think that the apples are the answer?

Pieter begon daarna te huilen en de appels lachten allemaal om hem, maar de eekhoorn bracht hen onmiddellijk te tot zwijgen en vroeg hem weer:
Then Pieter started to cry and all the apples laughed at him but the squirrel immediately shut them up and again said:

'Pieter, denk jij dat de appels van deze boom het antwoord voor op je vragen zijn?' Pieter antwoordde: '... maar, maar ik heb geen vragen te stellen, meneer Eekhoorn, ik begrijp niet wat u wilt zeggen!'
Pieter, do you think that the apples from this tree are the answer to your questions? So Pieter replied: ... but, but, I have no questions to ask, Mr. Squirrel, I don't understand what you want to say!

Dan,Toen kwam er onverwacht, een luide herrie kwam van de basis (voet) van de boom.
Then, all of a sudden, a loud noise came from the base of the tree.

Wat was dat, zeiden de appels? De eekhoorn stond in plaats daarvan stond bij stil en vroeg weer ondervraagde aan Pieter: de vragen Pieter, je vragen, de vragen die je altijd vraagt stelt, zijn deze vragen in de appels van deze boom?
What was that, said the apples? The squirrel instead stayed still and again inquired Pieter: the questions Pieter, your questions, the questions you always ask, are these questions in the apples from this tree?

De herrie was luider en alles de appels vreesden voor hun lot vreesden maar de eekhoorn was categorisch vastberaden en keek aan Pieter aan die niet wist niet wat te zeggen.
The noise was louder and all the apples feared for their destiny but the squirrel was resolute and looked at Pieter who didn't know what to say.

De luide herrie werd luider en luider, dan en stopte toen.
The noise became louder and louder, then stopped.

Langzaam verbrokkelde de boom brokkelde op de grond en alles de appels overal rolden overal heen; ook Pieter en de eekhoorn vielen.
Slowly the tree crumbled on the ground and all the apples rolled everywhere; also Pieter and the squirrel fell.

De appels jammerden in pijn, Pieter keek aan naar de termieten die knabbelden aan de boom en de eekhoorn zei weer zegde: PIETER! DENK JIJ DAT DE APPELS VAN DIE BOOM ZIJN DE BEANTWOORDEN VOOR OP JE VRAGEN ZIJN ZIJN? DE VRAGEN PIETER, JE VRAGEN, DE VRAGEN, DE VRAGEN...
The apples wailed in pain, Pieter looked at the termites that nibbled the tree en the squirrel again said: PIETER! DO YOU THINK THAT THE APPLES FROM THE TREE ARE THE ANSWER TO YOUR QUESTIONS? THE QUESTIONS PIETER, YOUR QUESTIONS, DE QUESTIONS...


... maar terwijl de eekhoorn dat zei zegde zo, kwamen er twee verplegers kwamenen die bonden de eekhoorn in een dwangbuis bonden en dan sleepten hem toen naar een psychiatrische inrichting sleepten.
... but while the squirrel said so, two nurses (male nurses right?, I hope I wrote it right) came and strapped the squirrel in a straitjacket and then dragged him to a mental institute.

Toen verzamelde Pieter dan verzamelde wat appels van de grond en ging terug naar huis ging.
Pieter then gathered some apples from the ground and went back home.

As you can see from the color pattern, you make most errors in word order.
Considering the complex sentences you make and the general difficulty level of Dutch word order, this is not surprising, but if you want to improve, there is clearly a lot of room for improvement there.

There is a large chapter on word order on this site, but I can imagine that it is a bit overwhelming. Here are some highlights:

The main difference in word order between Dutch and English (and I think Italian is like English on this) is in the place of verbs.
In a simple sentence, with only one conjugated verb, or in the main sentence of a complex sentence the conjugated verb is ALWAYS in the second place of the sentence (and all other verbs go to the end of the sentence).
De appels vreesden voor hun lot.
De appels moesten voor hun lot vrezen.
De eekhoorn stond stil.

Usually we start the sentence with the subject, but if you start the sentence with something else, you have to place the subject after the verb to keep the verb second.
Pieter verzamelde wat appels.
Toen verzamelde Pieter wat appels.

In a subclause, all verbs go to the end of the sentence.
Denk je dat de appels de antwoorden op je vragen zijn?

Some vocabulary to remember:
look at = kijken naar
at home = thuis
(go) home = naar huis (gaan)
to ask a question = een vraag stellen

[mor]

Ik wil allemaal danken.

Sadly these few days are a bit too busy to work anything out and it saddens me not only because I can't proceed like I would want, but also because I can't promptly respond to your precious corrections and suggestions.
I know you probably won't mind that'll take me a little longer to get back to you but still, I hate being late.

I have printed out your replies the last time and I'll now print out the new ones, in hope I can find the right time and mindset to get through them in a productive way.

I figure from Monday or Tuesday I'll have some more time and do my homework.

Thank you guys again, you are unbelievably kind and helpful.

Ciao.

[mor]

Here I am at last.

The last few weeks have been quite challenging and the outlook for the nearest future isn't that bright yet, still I finally have some time and peace of mind to catch up with my Nederlands learning.

Although I have been practicing what I've learned so far every time I had the chance, I've fundamentally been inactive since the last time I was here and I feel very out of shape.

I have thoroughly examined the corrections you've made to my short story and I have to admit I see a long road ahead of me and a lot more repetition of the same mistakes to correct for you. I still have to register my mind on the "frequencies" of the Dutch language, word order of course but also het vs de (and all that from this stems out) and a few other aspects that haven't clicked yet.

That said, I have a couple of very simple things I'd like to review:

1. wanneer vs toen
   
   When (no pun intended! ) is each to be used instead of the other?
   I feel there is a distinctions similar to why/because in English but I can't quite put my finger on it.
   
   
2. Bert's correction of "ik weet niet wat zegt u" was "Ik begrijp niet wat u zegt".
   All is fine with it, but I have a semantic question.
   
   I was wondering if in Dutch the use of "weten" in place of "begrijpen" in a similar situation might also achieve the meaning of "having no idea", of "being puzzled", of "being clueless" about something that has been said.
   Can "weten" be used for such a purpose as the English "to know" can or in Dutch a sense of "cluelessness" can't be carried on with "weten"?

Dank jullie voor je hulp.

[Bert]

Hello mor!

That said, I have a couple of very simple things I'd like to review:

1. wanneer vs toen
   
   When (no pun intended! ) is each to be used instead of the other?
   I feel there is a distinction similar to why/because in English but I can't quite put my finger on it.

For the English "when/if" you can use wanneer or als:

Wanneer/Als ze aan hem denkt, moet ze huilen.

For the English "when(ever)" (if it's a regular, repetitive action) you can use wanneer or als:

Wanneer/Als hij te laat opstaat, komt hij te laat op zijn werk.

If something has happend just once, you use toen:

Toen Jan dat zei, werd Marieke woedend.

The whole issue is much more difficult. (E.g. toen can also mean "then".)

Bert's correction of "ik weet niet wat zegt u" was "Ik begrijp niet wat u zegt".
All is fine with it, but I have a semantic question.

I was wondering if in Dutch the use of "weten" in place of "begrijpen" in a similar situation might also achieve the meaning of "having no idea", of "being puzzled", of "being clueless" about something that has been said.
Can "weten" be used for such a purpose as the English "to know" can or in Dutch a sense of "cluelessness" can't be carried on with "weten"?

Dank jullie voor je hulp.

Weten means kennis hebben van iets (having knowledge of something).

- Weet je hoe deze wasmachine werkt?
- Nee, ik weet het niet.

If you are clueless (in the sense that you have no idea), you can say: Ik heb geen idee.

I thought that in your story 'Ik begrijp niet wat u zegt' was the adequate version. Or: Ik heb geen idee wat u zegt. A less polite option (only in the context): 'Je kraamt onzin uit' (what you speak does not make any sense). Maybe you can also use 'Ik weet niet wat u zegt' (but your original word order was wrong anyway) - Joke could tell you.

[mor]

Dank je Bert.

You shed some light on the wanneer/toen issue, I guess I just need a higher mileage to fully grasp where each is more appropriate.

As for the weten/begrijpen question, your correction (and the meaning intended) was fine to me from the start. It just brought to my mind the curiosity to know if, beside my word order mistake, the use of weten was ok in Dutch as it is "to know" in English, to convey the same meaning. As you suggested in the end of your post, maybe Joke or other native speakers can tell.

Ciao